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Russia Ships in to Syria Matching Pro-ISIS Arms & Mercs

vladimir putin russia syria war

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#16 aus

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 07:04 PM

mmoghand, I agree that partipants in the Syria war have unteror motives. Sure a lot of money on the SUnni side comes from Saudia Asrabia. But The Usa has contributed a lot of assets. Even Issis has its own dubious supply of money.

The Shite side has money coming from Iran, Russia and even the Syrian government.

The same thing aoplies with human rights groups. They are supported by all sides to produce result favaurable to their side.

 

At least there is now representatives of all groups tryingto produce peace or ease fire in Syria. Only a unite action will work.



#17 mmoghand

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Posted 07 November 2015 - 09:01 AM

News out of Russia tells us that the fights at Aleppo and East of Latakia are pitting Chechen irregulars against Russian army and Syrian ground troops. There's the local tribal militias, which resemble the militias of the Antebellum Confederacy. The militias are mainly good at killing each other. Heavy weapons go with the Chechens and the Russian and Syrian armies. ISIS has hundreds of 20mm/23mm anti-aircraft guns mounted to Toyota pickup trucks.

 

Perhaps Ramzan Akhmetovich Kadyrov will see fit to donate a battalion or two of his special forces for the fight. Start with 5,000 and round it up to 10,000 over the next couple years. War is how you learn to fight. It's a fit.

 

Syria-Iran-Lebanaon-Iraq-Russia and why not Chechnya in force to make six ??? If IS can hold ground the Chechens on their side will make trouble decades ahead. So taking them out has to be a priority.

 

The Islamists are using recruits acquired through a front called Ajnad Kavkaz. Most of that inflow started with ISIS coming in through Turkey, but the Muslim Brotherhood area reaching up to Aleppo now depends on these troops to hold ground. North Africa had been the major source for cheap mercs early on. Now it's Chechens by the hundreds making the war a going operation.

 

Syria's big split is not Sunni vs. Shia. Not by a long shot. The prime divide is pro-Sharia vs. anti-Sharia -- easy to read on the ground. ISIS and MB usually cooperate with Nusrah (al-Q) to make the pro-Sharia army. These Chechens are mercs for pro-Sharia units. (Compare/contrast with Prussians and Scots for the British Army during the American Revolution.)



#18 aus

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Posted 07 November 2015 - 06:35 PM

It is easy to comit troops to Syria. But the problem is to get them out again. Russia has already been caught in afhganisan. I am not sure they will make the same mistake again. If you dont think this is about sunni and shites  , which side doyou think Russia will support?



#19 mmoghand

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Posted 08 November 2015 - 08:26 AM

It is easy to commit troops to Syria. But the problem is to get them out again. Russia has already been caught in afhganisan. I am not sure they will make the same mistake again. If you dont think this is about sunni and shites  , which side doyou think Russia will support?

 

Syria is a big training ground. "Get them out again" is not part of the calculation because the anti-Sharia forces see the pro-Sharia effort as a permanent social movement. Pro-Sharia is based out of an unassailable base that we call the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. This is nothing short a permanent war.

 

As long as KSA and its GCC allies finance al-Q -- twitter feed name: Jabhat a-Nusra -- and ISIS and Muslim Brotherhood there will be a major war in Syria/IraqLebanon. And everywhere else.

 

There will be terror actions aimed at Russia, Iraq, the Stans, the West, India, parts of Asia, and Israel. Africa will be invaded severally.

 

Russia made a mess of Afghanistan in the 70s and 80s. Thing is, their effort was largely an attempt to modernize the country and take out Saudi influence through the local network of pro-Sharia madrassahs. In hindsight Western opposition to the Russian invasion was ill advised.

 

Go back to the pro-Sharia-vs.-anti-Sharia divide to set up an understanding of what was happening. A Russified Afghanistan would have to be an improvement on what we were seeing 1990-2001 and the vast Narco State in operation today. Poppy money is the only big money in country. In comparison, Taliban is a nuisance.

 

Afghanistan is why heroin is cheap on streets around the world. Cheaper than Oxycontin.

 

The fights in Syria include propaganda scams that attempt to portray ISIS, MB and "Jabhat a-Nusra" as separate, warring factions. Sure thing, shots get fired now and then. But what they're doing it savaging the local militias. When analysis gets to a Follow The Money step, they're all three of them on the same gravy train. They have the same armorers: the same 20mm/23mm anti-aircraft guns, same mortars, same AKs. Same ammo boxes. Same antitank shoulder-launched missiles. Sourced out of Eastern Europe, delivered through Turkey.

 

Pro-Sharia implies barbaric attitudes across the social spectrum. Way worse than what the Arabs did in the 7th Century. Today's version is a combo of Sharia rules and psychopathic predations.



#20 mmoghand

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Posted 25 November 2015 - 09:54 AM

Turkey Downs Russian SU-24 Fencer

 

Official sources at the Russian military say they rescued one of the fliers. But the other one was killed by ground fire. All this with Turkey's Erdogan spouting a claim that he made the decision to defend his country's borders.

 

Putin framed the situation simply:

 

-- A "planned provocation."

 

-- "A knife in the back."

 

-- "Part of a pattern of assisting the Islamists"

 

Fair enough.

 

Meanwhile the pilot weighed in:

 

Captain Konstantin Murakhtin said that he couldn't possibly have flown over into Turkish airspace because the crew knew the region "like the back of their hand".

 

Gotta know there's going to be payback down the line.

 

Don't you ever get on a plane with Erdogan. Just saying.



#21 aus

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Posted 25 November 2015 - 07:28 PM

Turkey Downs Russian SU-24 Fencer

 

Official sources at the Russian military say they rescued one of the fliers. But the other one was killed by ground fire. All this with Turkey's Erdogan spouting a claim that he made the decision to defend his country's borders.

 

Putin framed the situation simply:

 

-- A "planned provocation."

 

-- "A knife in the back."

 

-- "Part of a pattern of assisting the Islamists"

 

Fair enough.

 

Meanwhile the pilot weighed in:

 

Captain Konstantin Murakhtin said that he couldn't possibly have flown over into Turkish airspace because the crew knew the region "like the back of their hand".

 

Gotta know there's going to be payback down the line.

 

Don't you ever get on a plane with Erdogan. Just saying.

It is interesting that the two countries involved were not religious. Turkey has a secular government and Russia is still Communists,



#22 Aint

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 10:16 PM

Islam is a front for political organizations in this war. 



#23 mmoghand

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 05:30 PM

It is interesting that the two countries involved were not religious. Turkey has a secular government and Russia is still Communists,

 

Turkey is ruled by a combination of Islamists and one-man rule.

 

Russia hasn't had a Communist in power since Gorbachev, before Boris Yeltsin. 1991/1992. With Putin the State intelligence apparatus took over executive power.

 

P.S. Donald Trump is America's Boris Yeltsin.

 

And for "Aus" here's the great interview for understanding Russia:

 

-- http://www.spiegel.d...s-a-780526.html


Edited by mmoghand, 27 November 2015 - 05:45 PM.


#24 aus

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 07:19 PM

mmoghand. says

 

 


Turkey is ruled by a combination of Islamists and one-man rule.

 

Russia hasn't had a Communist in power since Gorbachev, before Boris Yeltsin. 1991/1992. With Putin the State intelligence apparatus took over executive power.

 

P.S. Donald Trump is America's Boris Yeltsin.

 

And for "Aus" here's the great interview for understanding Russia:

 

-- http://www.spiegel.d...s-a-780526.html

I have Studies Russia for years.  with such books as "The Making of Modern Russia by Lionel Kochan and Richard Abraham  änd "Russia under the Old Regime "by Richard Pipes. I am also familiar with the changes in Russia in recent years, The interview with Gorbachev  indicates that even if things change in political terms, Russian leaders are still driven by History. Putin may appear different then earlier leaders but he has just adapted to the times. He has created an image of an all round sports man But he is like the others sees his place and Russia s leaders He can not suffer a lost like the downing of planes any more than past leaders. He may pretend to give lip service to the Russian Orthodox Church but he is not driven by religion .

 

I am not so familiar with Turkey  But I know their important leaders were secular. The present leadership  has kept a secular state. They are also driven by trying to return Turkey to the place they held in the past. They are not driven by religion. In the end it is the desire to reassert historical importance  that drive the leaders of these countries.


Edited by aus, 27 November 2015 - 07:21 PM.


#25 aus

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 08:07 PM

Aint says

 

Islam is a front for political organizations in this war. 

 

Ï am not sure what you mean by this. Are you saying that Islam is only the excuse  for Political organisations like IS. If so I could agree with you in some cases.

or are you saying Islam is responsible for this war?



#26 mmoghand

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 10:12 AM

IS is identified in areas it controls by instigating Muttawa militia-committee forces patterned on the Saudi Committee for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice.

 

Same rule book.

 

Women are beaten for any and all expressions of modernity. Men are flogged or executed for any slight aimed at The Prophet. It's Sharia Law with exaggerations by the hundreds.

 

The Syrian war was started on money supplied by the Saudis and other GCC pro-Sharia sources. Inflicting Sharia on Syria remains the prime goal for Muslim Brotherhood, Al Q's Nusrah, Daesh/ISIS. They leveraged a prolonged drought to generate a civil war.

 

Brotherhood has served as home for pro-Sharia efforts all over the Middle East. IS brought its crew out of Iraq after "The Surge" and went whole hog, if you will.

 

Religion ??? There's no connection to a spiritual entity. it's about blame. It's about controlling women like farm animals. Killing rivals. It's about recruiting psychopaths, paranoids, Using Major Depression as the tool for suicide bombings.

 

Is that Islam ???

 

Btw: the academic work on the Soviet Union is all well and good. Try "Lenin's Tomb" for better writing.

 

As to Turkey, AKP is a primitive social movement. Mostly rural like Iran's Alliance of Builders party. Xenophobic. Socially allied to IS.



#27 aus

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 06:54 PM

IS is identified in areas it controls by instigating Muttawa militia-committee forces patterned on the Saudi Committee for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice.

 

Same rule book.

 

Women are beaten for any and all expressions of modernity. Men are flogged or executed for any slight aimed at The Prophet. It's Sharia Law with exaggerations by the hundreds.

 

The Syrian war was started on money supplied by the Saudis and other GCC pro-Sharia sources. Inflicting Sharia on Syria remains the prime goal for Muslim Brotherhood, Al Q's Nusrah, Daesh/ISIS. They leveraged a prolonged drought to generate a civil war.

 

Brotherhood has served as home for pro-Sharia efforts all over the Middle East. IS brought its crew out of Iraq after "The Surge" and went whole hog, if you will.

 

Religion ??? There's no connection to a spiritual entity. it's about blame. It's about controlling women like farm animals. Killing rivals. It's about recruiting psychopaths, paranoids, Using Major Depression as the tool for suicide bombings.

 

Is that Islam ???

 

Btw: the academic work on the Soviet Union is all well and good. Try "Lenin's Tomb" for better writing.

 

As to Turkey, AKP is a primitive social movement. Mostly rural like Iran's Alliance of Builders party. Xenophobic. Socially allied to IS.

 

mmoghand You seem intent on blaming the wars in Syria and Iraq on Saudi Arabia and Turkey. It is true while both countries has play both sides against one another it is absurd to say either is IS. It is true that IS and the extreme Saudi Arabia government  treats women badly. It is also this is not supported  by most Muslims. It is not Islam as most understand it.

Turkey is scared tat The Kurds will demand territory in Turkey. So while it Allows the USA to use their airfields it does not support the main :"moderate":  opposition the Kurd



#28 mmoghand

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Posted 01 December 2015 - 04:24 PM

mmoghand You seem intent on blaming the wars in Syria and Iraq on Saudi Arabia and Turkey.

 

You betcha.

 

Bandar bin Sultan ("Bandar Bush") acknowledged that KSA backing what we called Al Qaeda in Iraq was a mistake. He ran their intelligence operation all through those years for Iraq and for Syria.

 

And for Turkey, we know now that $500,000,000 in oil was trucked out of Syria into Turkey in 2014. For all the drones in the CIA and DoD inventories, these organizations' leading BribeBees protected 95% of the ISIS oil transport assets. Call that treason, if you will.

 

Turkey going forward ??? AKP is a rural pro-Sharia movement. Erdogan looks to be obsessed with wealth and with building massive structures. His new executive office building ($1,200,000,000) is bigger than the Pentagon above ground.

 

The Turks and Kurds have had at it for centuries. Now eastern Syria and northern Iraq are going over to Kurdish control. This fits with Iranian objectives, clearly.

 

The Turkish Air Force came over and bombed armories up-country from Mosul. A lame effort to help ISIS hold on. We've watched Sinjar flip back and forth between IS and the Kurds -- now it's held by the Kurds and that completes the Surround phase for taking down Mosul..

 

With or without Turkish help, ISIS has no way to reinforce Mosul. That looks to be headed to a loss of 5,000 irregulars.



#29 aus

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Posted 01 December 2015 - 07:01 PM

mmghand you may be right that Tueey and Saudi Arabia  is partly to blame for the Syrian Iraki war. Yet others are also to blame. The USA and its allies for invading Iraq to get rid of Hassan, Russia for invading Iraq, Iran for interfering in its neighbours , The Kurds for fementing troule in Iraq ,Syria and Turkey. Shities dictators in Iraq and Syria for taking away rights for Sunnies and other Middle East factions for fighting one another. Of course this includes ISIS.

 

It is pointless in attributing blame. The solution is to vercome the problems all these countrries have cause. For the people of the region to negotiate a peace settlement that gives some rights to Sunies, Shtes and Kurds. Not everything they want because to do this would take away the rights of others. A sunnie dominated Middle East wouls deny any right to Shties. So would the opposite. If the Western powers are involve at all, it would mean Russia and the USA giving up their rights to dominate the Middle East. If these problems were solved ISIS would have no future.



#30 mmoghand

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 06:26 PM

The Saudis bear direct responsibility for financing AQI/ISIS/DAESH going all the way back to its efforts inside Iraq from 2005/2006.

 

The U.S. bears responsibility for invading Iraq, destabilizing the region.

 

Turkey did the pass through for $500,000,000 in oil in a year. That action is what has kept DAESH going.

 

"Russia for invading Iraq" ??? Afghanistan, you betcha.

 

Blaming the Kurds and the Alawites amounts to going after prime victims. The Saudi Committee for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice and its clients don't consider either ethnic group's version of the religion to be acceptable as proper Islam.

 

Btw: "Sunnis."





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