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#277484 - 08/03/08 03:53 AM Salim Ahmed Hamdan
lizbeth Offline
veteran member

Registered: 11/29/06
Loc: PNW
Salim Ahmed Hamdan is the first Guantanamo 'detainee' to be tried by military commission. He's alledged to have ferried weapons and ammunition for Al-Qaida while working as Osama bin-Laden's driver. It was his case that led to the Supreme Court's decision regarding a detainee's right of habeus corpus and the various political/legal machinations that ultimately led to the 2006 Military Commissions Act.

Is Hamdan a terrorist or is he a 38yr old Yemeni, father of 2 children, with a 4th grade education whose job was to be bin-Laden's driver?

Khalid Sheik Mohammed, the alleged Sept. 11 architect, in a written statement to the Commission maintains he "was a "primitive" chauffeur and mechanic who "was not fit to plan or execute" terrorist attacks."

Who is he, really?
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#277506 - 08/03/08 12:38 PM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: lizbeth]
Ray Global Moderator Offline
TM Chairman of the Board


Registered: 09/22/00
Loc: Arkansas, USA
Originally by: lizbeth
Who is he, really?

Hamden is a just a simple man who was doing the best he could with an abbreviated education to provide a better life for his family. He was a quiet boy who, the neighbors say, kept to himself and was always polite. But like many a young lad, he fell in with the wrong crowd and was led astray by those who kept their actual agenda hidden from this simple, trusting soul.

Rather than our condemnation, this man deserves our pity, our comfort, and a chance to make good on a life that was so full of promise before it was interrupted by the corrupt illegal machinations of the evil Americans.


signed,
ACLU legal team.
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#277530 - 08/03/08 07:11 PM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: Ray]
Lawmage Offline
member

Registered: 07/03/03
Loc: varies from day to day
Quote:
Liz asks: Is Hamdan a terrorist or is he a 38yr old Yemeni, father of 2 children, with a 4th grade education whose job was to be bin-Laden's driver?
The two are not mutually exclusive. If Hamdan facilitated the terrorist activities of bin Laden and the al Qaeda in general then he was indeed a terrorist. His lack of education does not change that.
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#277573 - 08/03/08 11:57 PM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: Lawmage]
lizbeth Offline
veteran member

Registered: 11/29/06
Loc: PNW
Law, I know you've had drivers in the past. Ray, I'm sure you've not.

So, Law, do you honestly believe that bin Laden's driver would be privy to the inner workings of an organization such as al Qaida?

This is an important case, no matter what its outcome. And, no matter what its outcome, the US still doesn't know what it'll do with Hamdan.

Ray, your sarcasm was so broad, even I understood it.
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#277577 - 08/04/08 12:13 AM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: lizbeth]
jokul Offline
Town Meeting Fixture

Registered: 03/10/02
Loc: Amarillo, Texas

I don't think the driver was privy to many details but he couldn't have been totally oblivious to who he worked for. That is like driving for the leader of the Mafia and then trying to say you didn't know the Mafia was up to no good. Not even remotely believable.
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#277581 - 08/04/08 04:35 AM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: jokul]
Lawmage Offline
member

Registered: 07/03/03
Loc: varies from day to day
I cannot categorically say whether or not the driver was privy to the most secret inner workings of al Qaeda or not as I have not seen the evidence against him. On the other hand, I can say that a driver is typically in the position to be privy to a great deal more than you think. Drivers often serve as a sort of bat man, one running errands for their senior. They typically keep the schedule for that person. They know where and with whom the person met. They often know the agenda of such meetings.
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#277612 - 08/04/08 03:37 PM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: Lawmage]
Bad Bird Offline
experienced member

Registered: 02/17/08
Loc: WA, USA
Originally by: Lawmage
I cannot categorically say whether or not the driver was privy to the most secret inner workings of al Qaeda or not as I have not seen the evidence against him. On the other hand, I can say that a driver is typically in the position to be privy to a great deal more than you think. Drivers often serve as a sort of bat man, one running errands for their senior. They typically keep the schedule for that person. They know where and with whom the person met. They often know the agenda of such meetings.

I wonder what sentence of Hitler's driver received in the Nurenberg trials?

Oh, you say he wasn't tried? Why do suppose that might be?
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#277628 - 08/04/08 06:04 PM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: Bad Bird]
Dax Administrator Online
Administrator

Registered: 08/01/99
Loc: New York, NY (New York)
Probably because he was an enlisted man and not an officer, or at most a lower ranking officer, and did not have the command status to be considered a war criminal.

We don't know about bin Laden's driver, how involved he was or was not in his boss' business.

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#277654 - 08/05/08 12:37 AM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: Lawmage]
lizbeth Offline
veteran member

Registered: 11/29/06
Loc: PNW
You can find the charge sheet at...

But why should I do your homework for you?

I'd think, as a military man with leanings toward law, you'd be interested enough to find it all out yourself. After all, this is as much Hamdan's trial as it is the 'proving' of the Military Commission Act.


Edited by lizbeth (08/05/08 12:41 AM)
Edit Reason: Added last paragraph
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#277963 - 08/08/08 04:21 AM Re: Salim Ahmed Hamdan [Re: lizbeth]
lizbeth Offline
veteran member

Registered: 11/29/06
Loc: PNW
Salim Hamdan was sentenced today to 5 1/2 years in prison. His sentence took into account the 5yrs 1mo. he's already served in Guantanamo which leaves him with a 5 month sentence to serve.

There are no provisions made for his detention during those 5 months and no plans made for him after his sentence is completed. As a matter of fact, Mr. Bush has already said that he'll be held indefinitely, leaving his disposition up to the next administration.

What will happen to what the Bush administration calls, 'unlawful enemy combatants?' There are still 200 of them left in Gitmo.

Will Mr. Bush's entire legal 'house of cards' come tumbling down?
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