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#241446 - 12/14/07 06:50 PM Steroid Use Among Baseball Players
Dax Administrator Offline
Administrator

Registered: 08/01/99
Loc: New York, NY (New York)
The Mitchell report on steroid use among baseball players lists approximately 300 players who were doping.

The most famous of these are Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens and Mark McGwire. (Bonds denies, it, Clemens' attorney strongly denies it. Don't know about McGwire.)

What's your opinion of steroid use by baseball players, and how has it affected our national pastime? What example does it set for the many children who love the sport and admire the players?

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#241447 - 12/14/07 06:54 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Dax]
Dax Administrator Offline
Administrator

Registered: 08/01/99
Loc: New York, NY (New York)
Let me answer my own question first.

I think we should either ban steroids outright, or permit them outright for professional athletes.

Banning drug use of any kind among players would set a good example for baseball. I think of Babe Ruth, who did what he did under the influence of hot dogs and beer.

Permitting it for all players would level the playing field and remove the stigma of the druggie athlete, since they'd all be druggies.

Your thoughts?

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#241448 - 12/14/07 06:57 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Dax]
jackdiddley Moderator Offline
World News/Sports moderator


Registered: 02/26/02
Loc: Britain - We're Not Afraid
Don't forget other big names such as Gary Sheffield, Miguel Tejada, and Eric Gagne.

Given the piss-poor attitude baseball has towards substance use, this really is no surprise. Perhaps now MLB will impose some real penalties for using performance enhancing drugs.
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#241494 - 12/14/07 11:32 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Dax]
stone Offline
Computer Tips Moderator

Registered: 01/07/03
I'm more concerned with the Hall of Fame aspect of it. By no means should players like Bonds be permitted in the Hall of Fame. It's a slap in the face and a complete insult to the players in the past who set these records without any performance enhancing drugs.

Bonds especially has no place in the Hall of Fame in my mind.
_________________________
-- Stone --
"Nine mile skid on a ten mile ride
Hot as a pistol but cool inside.
Cat on a tin roof, dogs in a pile,
Nothin' left to do but smile, smile, smile!!!!"
-- Jerry Garcia

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#241519 - 12/15/07 01:21 AM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: stone]
jokul Offline
Town Meeting Fixture

Registered: 03/10/02
Loc: Amarillo, Texas

Major League Baseball made their bed and now have to lie in it where the Hall of Fame is concerned. I believe they allowed people like Bonds to achieve records using performance enhancing drugs by simply turning a blind eye. They can't have it both ways, taking away honors while knowing they fostered the atmosphere that brought about the records. The only thing this report proves is they have no proof of cheating, but that is because they let proof slip by before. This gives a black eye to the sport but it is like giving a hooker a black eye, it won't drive away customers.
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No one loves you for who you are. They love you for who they are.

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#241607 - 12/15/07 12:07 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: jokul]
Chocolategenii Online
Domestic Affairs Moderator

Registered: 10/03/06
Loc: California
I don't know why this is so surprising to anybody? I was an athelete and competed in the early days of female bodybuilding and physic contests. I was one of the pioneers...

The early days were ok the sport's focus was to build a gorgeous female body with lots of curves. Then by 1985 women began massively growing out of proportion. Women I had known for years and who had no athletic background to advance in this new sport were much stronger and BIGGER than seasoned athletes.

Later, even Fitness competitors began experimenting with drugs. I can say this with certainty because I know many of them first hand.

Drugs have been in athletics for a long time. A professional athlete will have the money and backing to seek a good doctor for proper blood monitoring. An amateur doesn't have this opportunity; and the "secret" doping doctors are not on his rolodex...

The thousands of wannabe Barry Bonds, playing minor league (if that) baseball are doping up on their own. It's tragic!
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#241615 - 12/15/07 03:15 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Dax]
Cy_Click Offline

Can you hear me now?

Registered: 08/08/06
Loc: Minneapolis,MN
 Originally Posted By: Dax

......
I think we should either ban steroids outright, or permit them outright for professional athletes.
......


I think I pretty much feel the same way.

Personally, I like the idea of sport and the teamwork it should involve. In this respect, I'd like the participants to be the best available from unmodified human beings. There is, however, a thin line but unmodified or not. Certainly, extra push-ups would be an advantage in a test of stamina, but how to define what goes beyond man's abilities.

But if it's simply entertainment and the players are the 'objects' of that entertainment, I'm not sure I'd see any reason to oppose them using whatever it takes to entertain me. As long as they're happy with whatever they get out of it and accept any trade-offs, I don't think it would be cheating. And if my team wins, I might even overlook cheating.

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#241629 - 12/15/07 04:21 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Cy_Click]
Dax Administrator Offline
Administrator

Registered: 08/01/99
Loc: New York, NY (New York)
I heard from a reliable source (Bill O'Reilly) that a recent survey showed that 60% of US high school students admitted to cheating AND saw nothing wrong with it.

Not surprising, considering the leadership of the US today, and the baseball scandals will do nothing but convince more kids that it's just fine to cheat. Hey, everybody does it.

It's too bad Bonds, McGwire, Clemens and all didn't out a CIA agent. Then the President could pardon them.

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#241683 - 12/15/07 11:00 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Dax]
Ray Global Moderator Online
TM Chairman of the Board


Registered: 09/22/00
Loc: Arkansas, USA
Come on Dax. Stay on topic and quit trying to do some Bush-Bashing over an educational system that is populated by teachers and administrators who are overwhelmingly Democrats.
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Debating the Political Left or Speaking Truth to Kooks!

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#241713 - 12/16/07 07:02 AM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Ray]
jackdiddley Moderator Offline
World News/Sports moderator


Registered: 02/26/02
Loc: Britain - We're Not Afraid
I have to say, and this honestly saddens me, that American sport (with the exception of athletics, and possibly MLS, both of which look to international governing bodies) is so weak on the subject of performance-enhancing drugs.

MLB had (although it has improved slightly) the worst drugs policy int he world. A first failed or missed test would not even be made public, and it would take 7 (SEVEN) failed or missed test to cause a 1 year ban. The NFL is not much better, two players this year have had 4 match bans for using drugs. In Rugby League in this country, players would get a 4 match ban for punching someone...

Any other sport, in any other country, a failed drug test is an AUTOMATIC 2 year ban from competition. NO excuses, NO exceptions (Actually, that's not true. If you are Shane Warne, and you fail a test in Australia where they need your spin-bowling for the test side, you get away with it). A second failed test is a life-time ban.

I don't agree with the idea of making it OK to take performance-enhancing drugs. Firstly, it is dangerous. Secondly, it detracts from the competativeness of sport. When I watch an NFL game, I want the team that is a better football team to win, not the team that has pumped themselves full of more drugs than the other. Also, it promotes a quick-fix culture for youngsters, who'll be watching and thinking to themselves "They aren't as good, and they took drugs, and now they rock. I'm not as good as other kids, maybe that wil work for me too". I'm not sure we should be promoting that to children.

As it stands, high-school and college kids are taking pain-killers before games so they can play. If their injury hurts so much they need pain-killers to play through it, they should not be playing! By doing so, they risk serious, long-term health problems. Add into that sort of mix steroids and other performancing-enhancing drugs, and you have a health disaster waiting to happen.

All sports everywhere should be united against drugs, and I fully support the idea of "1 strike and you're out", and the two-year ban. The threat of such a suspension is so great that in most sports, the drug problem is minute. In sports where the threat isn't so bad, such as Major League Baseball, it's come right back to bite them in the ass.

It is now time for baseball to take a serious look at itself, and serious tighten up the drug policy. And it is time for Commissioner Goodell of the NFL to do the same, NOW, before this happens again to his league in a few years time.
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JackDiddley

Still Not Afraid
http://usatownmeeting.com
My Student Website

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#241736 - 12/16/07 01:41 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: jackdiddley]
Dax Administrator Offline
Administrator

Registered: 08/01/99
Loc: New York, NY (New York)
Jack, I don't think drugs will ever be banned from US professional sports.

There's too much money involved because of television contracts and (for the best players) commercial endorsements.

In the US today, we live in a culture where morality and 'doing the right thing' takes a back seat to the money.

It's always the money. I don't know what can be done about it. Mass communication, the shrinking economy, and human greed will supercede honor and integrity every time.

"Sad but true." --CassielA

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#242463 - 12/20/07 09:15 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Dax]
jackdiddley Moderator Offline
World News/Sports moderator


Registered: 02/26/02
Loc: Britain - We're Not Afraid
OK, poll time. Please note: PED = Performance-Enhancing Drug
Do you think PEDs should be allowed in professional sport?
You may choose only one


Votes accepted starting: 12/20/07 09:14 PM
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll.
_________________________
JackDiddley

Still Not Afraid
http://usatownmeeting.com
My Student Website

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#242468 - 12/20/07 09:44 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: jackdiddley]
Dax Administrator Offline
Administrator

Registered: 08/01/99
Loc: New York, NY (New York)
For some reason I was unable to vote directly from your post, so I will vote here. No, PEDs should not be allowed in professional sports.

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#242469 - 12/20/07 09:45 PM Re: Steroid Use Among Baseball Players [Re: Dax]
lizbeth Offline
veteran member

Registered: 11/29/06
Loc: PNW
It is sad, Dax, especially for kids who are ruining their lives before they've even begun. But greed over honesty is rampant in certain economic classes--not just sports. And the kids, then, learn their lessons from their parents rather than from some highly admired, highly touted sports icon.

Alex Rodreguiz--A Rod, the business man,--isn't a particular favorite of mine; but he, at least, seems to honestly play the game for himself. If he's honest in that, it can be assumed that he's honest when he says that he doesn't take PEDs.

It would be nice if we could take baseball back to the time of Mom's apple pie and the tooth fairy leaving a nickle for incisors and a dime for molars, but it won't happen.
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Tomorrow's just your future yesterday. Craig Ferguson

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