Dax- Some may continue to think he's the gold standard, but more and more people are seeing the tarnish.

Wax- Thanks to people like you who point out the obscure!

Look... Bush is not all that great of a leader, there have been better and there have been worse.
But the fact is that New Orleans has been below sea level for quite some time now. Indeed... for a very long time.
The levees that failed were built to replace levees that were worse, a very long time ago, long before 2002.

Now, could a refurbishing of these walls in the last few years stopped a critical failure caused (not by the executives in charge but instead by) a catagory four hurricane?
It is very doubtful, but we just don't know.
We do know that the only solution to this eventual failure was (and remains) the evacuation and permanent closing of New Orleans itself.

It is extremely easy after a natural disaster strikes to blame those in charge. But such a thing is really beneath you.

So let us put this in perspective folks.

Eventually the city of Seattle, Washington will be destroyed.
This will occur in some form from a number of events.
The city lies beneath a volcano, amd sits inside a natural bowl.
Hundreds/Thousands/or Millions will die from either tsunami or mudflow.
This could happen tomorrow... or next year... or one hundred years from now. But it will happen, and nothing can be done about it whether you are a Republican or a Democrat.

Eventually the city of San Francisco, California will be destroyed.
This will occur in some form from a number of events.
The city sits on a large fault line, and it's very foundation was formed from rubble.
Hundreds/Thousands/or Millions will die.
This could happen tomorrow... or next year... or one hundred years from now. But it will happen, and nothing can be done about it whether you are a Republican or a Democrat.


Eventually the entire island of Galveston, Texas will be destroyed, along with most of Houston.
This will occur whether we like it or not.
The places sit in the path of known destruction, and the hurricane so many are crying over now was nowhere near as powerful as they can get!
Hundreds/Thousands/or Millions will die.
This could happen tomorrow... or next year... or one hundred years from now. But it will happen, and nothing can be done about it whether you are a Republican or a Democrat.

The point is of course that disasters are known as disasters for a reason, and we couldn't stop them if we wanted.
No one likes it when it happens, and that includes Bush.
You want to blame somebody?
Blame God (it works for me!)
But if you are going to start picking out decision makers how about the people that decided to live next to an ocean in a spot that was below sea level?
Too cold and unfeeling? Not as much fun as pointing fingers at a leader you happen to not like?
Well again... I would suggest blaming God, because you would be much closer.

BTW: There is not a single municipality which does not request money to fix something every year. Teddy Kennedy himself wants money to replace the sand that has eroded from his multi-million dollor beaches.
Unless you (or anyone else) can prove to me that the "improvements" requested would have prevented this failure... and that Bush/Clinton/et al, knew that this perversion of weather was coming...

Whatever, Dax...Nothing Bush does is going to please you and you are gonna bitch about everything that happens, whether Bush was at fault or not. of course, to your politicized view, EVERYTHING is his fault.

The failure of the levees in NO is not Bush's fault no matter how much you want it to be so. Is it FEMA or Bush or the Federal government's job to build levees for NO? I would argue it is the job of the State and City government to build and maintain those levees. The Federal government helps with the building and maintaining of those levees because there is a Federal interest in doing so, not because such is a Federal duty. You bitch that Federal funding for the levees was cut? That tells me that there was in fact Federal funding for the the levees. So, you think the Federal funding was inadequate? Why didn't YOU pay for the repairs yourself? Its not your responsibility? Well, news flash you politically motivated hack, its NOT the Federal government's responsibility either!

And as for the President being the gold standard...I hardly think the man or his administration are the gold standard. I am even willing to admit that on somethings, you beloved Clintons provided better leadership and more efficient and effective government. I am pretty sure you could comb through these boards and find a litany of complaints about Bush posted by myself. The difference is, you appear to have some insatiable and irrational need to bitch and complain and BLAME every single thing you dislike on the President. Your noise to signal ratio is way too high and the end result is your message and the forum in which it is delivered have lost any appeal.

....sounds like he's just having a bad day, Jack.

Dax may be incessant about his critique of the Bush Administration, but there has to be a corresponding incessant wish to defend and protect that Administration no matter what to cause such irritation on Lawmage's end.

2 sides of a coin.

Helice, there is a world of difference between saying it is not fair to blame the administration for things that are not its fault and defending the administration's action or inaction. Frankly, I am not impressed with the Bush administration. However, I do not see the need to trumpet from the rooftops the lie that EVERYTHING is the Administration's fault.

For Jack, New Orleans wanted 75 million to repair the levees. The Feds gave them 30 million, forty percent of what they wanted. New Orleans and Lousiania can raise revenue as well. The other 45 million can, and apparently should, have come from State funds. I think it is manifestly unfair to blame the Federal government (regardless of which party or President is in office) for failures by the State and Local government. Those levees are in Louisiana. They exist to protect the city of New Orleans. I ask you, who should have had the most compulsion to maintain them? Apparently the mayor and the governor did not feel repairing the levees was urgent or they would have raised the funds or diverted them for that purpose. Yet, we do not see Dax bitching about them or blaming them. Instead, he chooses to blame the administration. He does it not because he gives a crap about NO or Louisiana, he does it because its a convienent stick with which to beat on the President.

Lawmage, Louisiana is one of the poorest states in the country. 18% of the state lives below the poverty level. 30% of New Orleans lives below the poverty level. So perhaps the city and state really didn't have the money to spend on these levees and maybe, just maybe, that's why they were asking the feds for money.

And it's obvious now that it would have been in the feds best interest to fork over that money. Considering the fact that Bush has a history disregarding warnings of impending disasters, I can understand Dax's frustration with the president.

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Lawmage: Why didn't YOU pay for the repairs yourself?

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Ah, but my tax dollars DO pay for the Federal support that goes to Louisiana and helps maintain the levees.

It's not repair, by the way, but enhancement which many people believe could have prevented not the hurricane itself, of course, but the flood damage caused by the breaching of the levees.

But not only would I have authorized an additional few dollars of my money to go to taxes to pay for this, the money I DID give the government was diverted from the project to pay for the war in Iraq. You cannot say the President is blameless in this, or that I am just bashing him. He is, in a very real way, responsible for the turmoil, chaos and insecurity the nation is undergoing at this time. I'm sorry if that pisses you off, but I would be remiss as a citizen to not be angry about it.

As a side note, which I really should have mentioned earlier, I'm very glad that you and your family are, by the grace of God and/or the United States Military, out of Louisiana and harm's way.

I have just one question about the money they recieved, did any of that money repair any part of the levees in any way? Just curious.

The bickering over all this is crazy. It does not matter how many repairs were done, it would not have matter one bit. when wind and water with that much force hits anything regardless of how solid, it is going to be damaged, most often destroyed. There is no such thing as hurricane proof.

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Dax said: The Bush family fortune continues to be funded by which of the following?

a) oil
b) medicines & pharmaceuticals
c) hurricane relief supplies
d) bullets

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Sheesh, you forgot, e) all of the above

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Rancher said: Why cant the oil industry be as regulated as public utilities and phone rates are regulated!

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It's pretty obvious that you haven't been hit by one or more hurricanes. Our public utilities and phone rates have gone up drastically since last year, and due to Katrina we're looking at another boost. That's what you call regulated?


Oh, and by the way, gas is up to $2.92 a gallon here.